BataMbira - Spiro latest CD!

[JohnnyConga]

Here is another one for you Zara...Anga Diaz has just released a CD called "Echu Mingua". Now he also "fuses" Bata with some African drummers on jimbe tamani and n~goni. What would you say to him? Anga calls his CD a "spiritual mass"....I'd like to see you and him go at it...one of your own...he has also "melded" Hip Hop with Cuban drumming...my God u must be having a "fit" by now....."JC" Johnny Conga.... ???

[JohnnyConga]

He also recorded John Coltrane's "A Love Supreme" using 7 tuned congas along with Bata....Echu Mingua is HIS Santo...."JC" Johnny Conga.....

[zaragemca]

Brother JC,I don't know why is the reason for which you are still missing the point...I'm an authority in Afrocuban Music before Mr.Spiro, who started getting in to this in the Mid 80's.(I didn't come to Cuba,I was born in to this Ok...and together with the fact that I knew the structure of Rock and Jazz before comming to the U.S.),.Now having knowledge in the Afrocuban Music,(HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH BEEN AN AUTHORITY IN THE YORUBA RELIGION).If you know so much about him,tell me which is his position in the Yoruba Religion,(not just batalero please),to have the authority which you said he has.In relation to the copyright the first recording of the ,(Orichas Songs),was done by Dr. Obdulio Morales in the Panart-Studios,in Cuba with the proper supervision and authority,(that would give according with the law),a copyright from any related ,or subsequences recording of this music,(and for you knowledge),not knowing this,have brought trouble to a lot of musicians in the music business,(not related to this music but other kind of music).As I said before,PLAYING BATA IN ANY OTHER MUSIC HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS SUBJECT, so if somebody want to do Bata Rap,Bata Rumba,Batacum,Batanga,this is not what this subject is all about JC...Bata have been used in a non Yoruba-Music since 1930's, I already said that..Since what time 'Love Supreme' of Coltrane's is Yoruba Ceremonial Music?..Putting congas and Bata together is not'PLAYING YORUBA CEREMONIAL MUSIC'. The name 'Spirutual Mass',is absolutely a non Yoruba references.There are people which practice what is called spiritism,(which is not the practice of Yoruba Religion..The point is that all references have been wrong,we are wasting time with this debate.Dr Zaragemca.



Edited By zaragemca on 1115914677

[JohnnyConga]

OK DOC....whatever you say, mi socio.....u the man!....."JC" Johnny Conga......PS there isn't one Cuban Copyrighted music that is protected that I know of here in the US..also known as "derechos reservados".....

[zaragemca]

Greeting you always would be my brother in percussion.The copyright law is and international law.There is not other country where it is enforced with more tenacity than in the U.S.A.,there are a lot of musicians,entertainers,intelectuals,etc,going to Federal Court for litigation in this respect.Dr.Zaragemca



Edited By zaragemca on 1115914972

[JohnnyConga]

Zara ..why don't u just listen to Spiro's CD and then make an opnion on it?.......I'd like to hear it myself....I haven't heard it yet , but if it is like Bata-Ketu(which is incredible), I imagine it is just as good.....peace...."JC" Johnny Conga....

[loopi]

Well this is certainly a pearl of a thread . .. . . . . . .

Recently discovered this whole site love the work, love the characters, saved my life . . . . . . thankyou to all . . . . . My first official post . ....... have to respond to what i'm seeing.

No one can hear what the good Dr is trying to say because they are all too busy justifying their particular position, which in turn justifies what ever they are doing and thinking of doing in their lives musically and otherwise (particularly, with all due respect, Mr Abakwa ). I've noticed through this whole site no matter what the discussion a lot of Dr Zaragemca "bashing" . . . . . . . . from individuals usually fuelled by not being able to interpret correctly what is trying to be said. I appreciate how difficult it must be to communicate in written English and this is where i see a lot of misunderstanding originating. Dr, i hear you, i hear the distinctions u are making and respect the deep historical and religious understanding you have of some of the musics originating on the African continent and admire your willingness to put up with the misunderstandings and abuse in an attempt to keep the story undistorted by the ego of the day.

Thankyou Dr. Zaragemca

Thankyou JohnnyConga

In Gratitude . . . . . . Loopi !

[windhorse]

I have the CD in question, and it is beautiful.

On another note,, what is one man's sacred and holiest, is another's toilet paper....

It's the job of the American musician to hybridize everything. No tradition will be followed, except the tradition of not following traditions. All we Americans can do - like it or not - is modify what we come in contact with.

We are the Borg,,, Resistance is futile,,, You will be assimilated...
???

[JohnnyConga]

WELCOME LOOPI.....u may be right about the misinterpretation of Zara's words and where he is coming from. But we are some very passionate musicians here and we are a "family" that will agree to disagree, and disagree to agree, which makes this site invaluable. Yes sometimes one may get a bit overzealous with answers or retorts, but I believe in the end WE ALL learn something from it and that is what it's all about...soooooooooo......don't be discouraged or anything, sometimes "family's" fight too over what they may believe in.....peace...."JC" Johnny Conga....

[zaragemca]

Welcome Loopi,and the rest of the participants,I would give the thanks to Tamboricua,by bringing this subject, I was able to clear a lot of misunderstanding,and misconception,and more important to clear the names of a lot cuban musicians which some people thought had done something wrong,(in relation with the Yorubas Religious Music),when in reality it was not the case.Dr.Zaragemca



Edited By zaragemca on 1116266992

[ABAKUA]

Fuk me dead, have you got your head that far up your ass?

You have not corrected shit. Noone but you has said anyone has done anything wrong.

Fuk, I give up with you man, you need to get out a little more, and perhaps take a look outside of your own ego to see whats happening musically in the world and particularly in Cuba at the moment.
Cantos sagrados and toques have been mixed with countless genres of music by both Cuban and non Cuban musicians the world over for many years.

[zaragemca]

There are a lot of forum members,that when they don't know a subject,they listen,or ask a question,the worst thing that could be done is pretending to know something,(when it is not a crime not to have knowledge about a subject),and not having the foundation to back it up..Dr.Zaragemca



Edited By zaragemca on 1116434681

[davidpenalosa]

Some of the most respected batá masters have used the batá drums in completely non-traditional musical experiments. The late Jesus Peréz, considered by many to be the most important batá master of the second half of the 20th Century took part in very unconventional "art music". In a sacred context, Jesus Peréz was known for keeping the liturgical aspects of the batá intact. Obviously, he knew the drums could be used in different contexts. There's plenty of CDs out there with Francisco Aguabella and the late Julito Collazo playing batá in salsa and jazz bands. Batá master Regino Jimenez played batá live in a descarga with my salsa band. Spiro's Bata Ketu and Bata Mbira are in keeping with the tradition of using the batá drums in non-traditional musical experiments.

-David Peñalosa

[ABAKUA]

Welcome to the forums man!

This be you right?


or here on the left on Okonkolo?:






Now thats what I call a drum circle!



Edited By ABAKUA on 1117423093

[davidpenalosa]

Yikes, I'm outed! Yes, that's me with a hat on sometime between 1982-84. Me on okónkolo with Harold Muñiz and Mike Spiro in more recent years, at the 2002 Annual Afro-Cuban Dance and Drum workshop in Arcata. Also, a rumba class at the 1995 workshop (a portion of me can be seen in the far extreme left). That was a circle of drums, but not a drum circle. It was an oversized class in which they were all playing a particular part in unison while I accompanied them on the claves.

-David