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Posted: **Tue May 25, 2004 7:05 am**

Hello,

In this moment I try to improve my Jazz playing. For the slow to middle tempos I swing some tumbaos and I incorporate fills, but for the faster tempos I need councils and suggestions. On which basic pattern can I refer ?
I know a little about Cubop, Ray Barreto but what can I listen to the old one and modern jazz with conga players ? I know there is many style of jazz…many ways to play congas on jazz, but if you give me some ideas, I apreciate.

Thanks in advance.

Posted: **Wed May 26, 2004 2:58 pm**

There are several styles to the subject,since it would be related to the type of jazz which is played,Armando Peraza,Mongo Santamaria, Patato Valdez,Sabu Martinez,Chano Pozo,Ray Barreto,etc,are a few styles which could be check it out.Types of Jazz could be,Modal,Smoth-Jazz,Afro-Jazz,Avant-garde,hard bop,Fusion,Blue-jazz,Acid Jazz,etc.,the most difficult being free-jazz.

Edited By zaragemca on 1085600699

Posted: **Thu May 27, 2004 10:21 am**

Hi Zaragemca,

I thought that there were a basic rhythm or a way of playing when the tempo is fast for the "traditional jazz", you know when the "Chabada" on the ride is fast. I need to test and listen to all this percussionist reference.
I hope my English is comprehensible, I use a translator sometimes.

Thanks for the help Zaramenga

Posted: **Thu May 27, 2004 12:55 pm**

Colacao,

Practice, practice.....You have to listen to everything. What "tumbao" is correct? As long as you are in clave you will be fine! Eventually, you will become proficient enough that everytime you will find what you like and what is with your proficiency.

Regarding speed, keep on practicing that "left hand" (or right hand if you are left handed) and practice your speed. Believe it or not for faster tempos you could use less strokes or go slower, as long as you are in clave, and you will have a "good tumbao" or pace.

Saludos!

Posted: **Mon May 31, 2004 5:56 pm**

Somehow this post didn't make it here so I will post this again....If you want to hear congas/bongos in a total Jazz setting, then you have to hear Percy James. He was a "hand drummer" with a band called "Quartet Tres Bien", just bass piano drums and perc. Now Percy is not a "typico" player at all and does not even play any type of particular rhythms at any length , what he does is "embellish" the music with his drums. It is a "style" all unto himself,the closet style to him would be "Big Black". So if you really want to hear Jazz Congas/with bongos this is the cat to listen to. They recorded in the 60's on the Decca label. They recorded so far as I know about 9 albums, I have four of them and know where to get 2 more, haha ha...on vynil too....Percy James Jazz Hand Drummer, check him out!........JC JOHNNY CONGA.... :;):

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2004 2:54 pm**

JC, I've see Percy play many times. His knowledge of jazz is heavy but his playing is not. Maybe it's his style... Quartet Tres Bien is playing a free jazz fest in St. Louis on June 30th at the Missouri Botanical Gardens.

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2004 4:57 pm**

...I practice…I try, but sometimes I have doubts about the way to take.
I didn't know Percy.
I will try to find some old jazz things with congas in a music store. I would say to you what I have find.

Thank you all

Colacao

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2004 5:22 pm**

Jingo...The Quartet is still around???? wow i thought they were long gone. I know Percy's style is not for everyone, he doesn't even slap the drum. I did say he "embellishes" the music in his way of playing. Here are 2 other heavy hitters in Jazz congas...Ramon Lopez, who recorded with the Stan Kenton Orch. early 70's, and a friend of mine who has since passed on . Mr. Lee Pastora(Billy Cobham-Don Ellis Big Band.) These two were great players also in "oddtime" playing. You had to be to play in the Don Ellis band. They are both on recording with these bands. Check Lee out with Cobham,he was very creative and had great hands. Lee was from Argentina and has a twin, who also played.......JC JOHNNY CONGA....

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:32 pm**

Yeah, they're still around... I'm not sure how many original members are in the band but Percy is still there.

Posted: **Tue Jun 01, 2004 9:49 pm**

Guest wrote:...I practice…I try, but sometimes I have doubts about the way to take.
I didn't know Percy.
I will try to find some old jazz things with congas in a music store. I would say to you what I have find.

Thank you all

Colacao

Another way you can take is talk to a jazz trap drummer and and see what he does and try to implement some of what the drummers does on the trap set onto the congas.

Posted: **Wed Jun 02, 2004 3:43 am**

For faster tempos, you can go to ways: increase note density (playing faster and thus more notes), or decrease it (playing slower). This may sound kind of stupid, but this idea is a hallmark of Gamelan music. They use different tempo/densities called irama. Goring from a slower, less dense irama to a faster, denser irama is a really dramatic effect inwhich the music builds in intesity then the structure changes on a dime sort of like a music version of the Matrix.

Back on subject, for fast tempos, you don't necessarily have to be doing anything extra. Playing at half speed/half density can work. I've heard this done with some fast R&B music, and a relatively slow tumbao on congas that worked really well.

Posted: **Wed Jun 02, 2004 7:26 pm**

Got to be careful in that game the parameter of the beat could be changed and the pulse of the rhythms is going to change with it.

Posted: **Wed Jun 02, 2004 8:28 pm**

That's where rehearsals come in!

Posted: **Fri Jun 04, 2004 2:54 pm**

It is not about rehearsal,you said that you have heard it on fast R&B,and I also have listened some stuff where the structure of what is played have been destroyed becouse percussionists which didn't know what they were doing.(that's why it is important to have a producer in the recording studio which know his stuff).I have been on both sides of the coin as producer, and session musician,having the opportunity to save some recording from getting in the hole.

Edited By zaragemca on 1086361224

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