Bell or Guataca for Guaguanco

[windhorse]

yep

[+pablo+]

if you noticed i didn't try to write out cinquillo because, well i wasn't sure how to! (fitting it with clave). i still count it as 1-2-3-4-5-1-2-3 etc... and for some reason never get lost (i.e. two cinquillos for one clave). Sort like counting cascara as ‘I got rit-mo like ti-to puen-te hey…’

thanks for writing it out. plus i got an extra pattern from the post.

as to never having an occasion to play cinquillo, you'll be surprised on how many songs in your library cinquillo will 'fit' into. pop-on your headphones, grab a stick…

as to too many hits, i guess cascara also has 10 hits per clave. this is also another pattern that fits into a lot of music, even non-latin.

so standing in the grocery line, waiting to checkout, i’m never bored; always tapping out something…it’s all good

hmm… now back to that rumba 3/2 thing...

[davidpenalosa]

Hi,
I saw the clave signal shining in the sky and got here as soon as could. Dave, you are doing great. No need to call for Dr. Clave.

A few things:

o When you play or tap the main beats ("pulse" as you called it), you are not playing in 2/4 or 4/4. You are still in a triple-pulse structure, which is usually written in 6/8 in Latin music, although I prefer 12/8.

1+a2+a3+a4+a

4/4 is:

1e+a2e+a3e+a4e+a

o In folkloric genres such as rumba, some songs begin on the three-side and some on the two-side. If the song enters on the two-side, it’s just coming in half way through the clave pattern. The "one" is always on the three-side in folkloric music. Clave is the key.

(Repeat after me everyone ) – The 3-2, 2-3 concept does not apply to folkloric music; it refers to where a chord progression begins in popular music like salsa. I have yet to encounter a Cuban folklorist who uses the 3-2, 2-3 concept.

o The Tomas Cruz books are all about popular music. They specifically concern the conga patterns Tomas played in Paulito’s timba band. The confusing thing is that a lot of his conga inventos are band adaptations of folkloric rhythms. Nonetheless, they are still within the popular, rather than folkloric sphere and therefore the 3-2, 2-3 framework is appropriate.

o Cinquillo is used for makuta and many other rhythms, but not guaguanco. There are two cinquillo cells per clave. Cinquillo is an embellishment of tresillo and expresses the three-side of clave.

o Pablo, counting the cinquillo strokes: 1 2 3 4 5 may work for you, but to play grounded I suggest that you count the main beats, but the bell strokes. That makes the bell strokes: 1 + a e + . It will probably be more difficult, but it will pay off big time in the end.

o While the bell or guataca are not used in guaguanco, they are used in the rumba form columbia.

-Dr. Clave

[bongosnotbombs]

I take it back, I have played cinquillo, in Makuta, I just didn't
refer to it as such, but now that it's mentioned I can see it.

[thomas newton]

...I prefer 12/8.

1+a2+a3+a4+a

Could you indicate for us neophytes where the clave would strike in relation to this count, Doc?

A+ thread imo.

[thomas newton]

...I prefer 12/8.

1+a2+a3+a4+a

Could you indicate for us neophytes where the clave would strike in relation to this count, Doc?

A+ thread imo.

My reading shows that the answer is x-x--x-x-x--

[davidpenalosa]

Hi Thomas,
That's right. The pulse names of those strokes ("X" in your notation) are:
1 1a 2a 3+ 4

-David