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Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 11:18 amby TONE74
Is the " gallop " in Habana guaguanco (segundo part ) the same as the Matanzas one. I've been learning both but Im kind of confused because the Matanzas one uses more bass tip and the Habana one is more slaps so it sounds different. Im trying to find the right feel to each one but Im not sure if they are really the same. Thanks
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 12:37 pmby windhorse
No they're not the same. You said it in your question. The Havana style gallops. The Matanzas style is a straighter flow.
But, they both have a slap right before and after the first strike of clave.
It's just that without basses the Havana style can really bring out the slaps.
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:02 pmby TONE74
Ive seen the matanzas one and it does gallop, to me anyway. It just seems more difficult to me to get the hang of it like I did the Habana one. I guess its just a matter of practice. This is a Matanzas one he calls it Chapeo ( I think this is a segundo part not sure )
http://youtube.com/watch?v=frhfc5oo-qo
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:20 pmby tamboricua
Tone74,
Chapeo is only the first pattern he demonstrates on the video clip. Notice no open tones, just the combination of Palm + Tip strokes alternating hands.
It works as an "Intro" to the Guaguancó Matancero.
After that he broke into the basic Guaguancó Matancero Segundo ride adding couple of variations.
Hope this helps!!!
Best...
Jorge Ginorio
Edited By tamboricua on 1191950526
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 5:37 pmby zaragenca
And taking into account,(as I said before), that Habana didn't have single style anyway, it would depend which one neighborhood you were coming from.Dr.Zaragemca
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 6:09 pmby TONE74
OK, so as Windhorse said they are not the same. My problem is getting the swing of the gallop or whatever he is doing in there because to me thats what gives it the flavor and Im having a hard time with it. The Habana one I bunch in threes and got the hang of it right away. Is the Matanza one in threes or fours or none at all ? Am I the only one that hears the gallop. Can someone share how they got the hang of it. Thanks
Edited By TONE74 on 1191961778
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 7:40 pmby zaragenca
As I said before,it all depend in what parameter you are setting the articulation in relation to the Clave...you have to feel the Clave,if you don't feel it,I cann't help you...The first thing I set up in my students is the concept of the metric,(Clave,or Signature),and the parameters.Dr. Zaragemca
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 8:44 pmby guarachon63
Hi Tone, great that you are getting into this stuff.
My suggestion would be to pick up "Rumba Caliente 88/77" by Los Munequitos de Matanzas (if you don't already have it), tune your drum to the open tone of the segundo, put on headphones and play along.
"Folklore Matancero" is also very useful because the drums are recorded on one channel and the vocals on the other, so by playing with the balance knob you hear the drums very clearly.
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:01 pmby TONE74
I think I'm getting it, I guess they go in fours. I accidentally found a jungle house beat while I was at it 
Thanks for your help.
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 9:05 pmby TONE74
Guarachon thanks for the suggestion, I'm gonna check that tune out.
Posted:
Tue Oct 09, 2007 10:07 pmby tamboricua
Tone 74,
I think you will benefit grandly by checking out Michael Spiro's Conga Drummer's Guidebook on Sher Music Publications. He covers this proper phrasing issue or what he calls "finding fix" in a entire section of the book.
Michael suggest to:
1. Take the complete phrase and divide it in two halves.
2. Start each half on the anticipation.
3. View the second segment as a response to the first one.
Hope this helps!!!
Best...
Jorge Ginorio
Posted:
Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:27 amby TONE74
Jorge, I was checking out your website and saw you and Spiro in a picture together. Did you guys ever work together?
I bought that book not long ago but haven't gotten into it yet. It's a little advanced for my level but I'm planning to get to it soon. Also it focuses more on the Habana guaguanco. I got into this in march and man I'm overwhelmed with all the stuff thats out there. I feel like it will take me a life time to learn it. Right now I'm trying to focus in one thing but I'm all over the place. I though I would of calmed down by now but I still got the fever .
It would be a lot easier with a teacher but I don't know anyone thats into what I like which is the more Cuban rumba type stuff. I play with some guys from around the way but they just want to jam and not learn real in clave rumba so what I learn I learn alone. Thanks
Posted:
Wed Oct 10, 2007 12:34 amby JayMacho
The gallop in matanza style was explained to me as mama-daddy. Meaning heel-heel, toe-toe. Like a train...
Posted:
Wed Oct 10, 2007 1:40 amby Tonio
TONE74 wrote: I though I would of calmed down by now but I still got the fever
.
It would be a lot easier with a teacher but I don't know anyone thats into what I like which is the more Cuban rumba type stuff.
If you loose the fever to learn, you won't get anywhere. So thats a good thing its still burning in you, the funny thing is when you start learning some stuff, you actually get more hungry. But keep an open mind and don't take all of any instructions/studies (if any) to heart there are many variations. Learn where the feel/groove and boundaries are and move on to other variations.
The thing is w/ rumba you need the other 2 drums (at least) to really learn where the groove is. Once you find the real groove, improvising comes naturally or can be learned by listening to some of the top cats. But , yeah having a teacher does give you quicker results -if they are good with good material. As Jc always says: being good musician/performer does not wqual a good teacher.
T
Edited By Tonio on 1191980444
Posted:
Wed Oct 10, 2007 2:40 amby bongosnotbombs
I can second Tonio, it's really hard to keep the inspiration to learn rumba all by yourself, it's made to be played with other people.