Yambu Clave

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Yambu Clave

Postby Quinto Governor II » Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:11 pm

Are the 2 claves used in Yambu associated with Havana and Matanzas? Thanks!

I've been looking for a breakdown of the parts to Yambu for a long time. these 2 are the only ones I've found so far, and have been very helpful. I notice Salloum starts with slaps and uses an open tone for the 3rd stroke, whereas; the Cuban starts with 2 opens followed by 2 slaps. Which way do you guys play it. Not that one is right and the other wrong, or is it, maybe in some circles?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpR6ml7qJoA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwRFA14f ... re=related
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby thomas newton » Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:48 pm

Here's a recent discussion. http://mycongaplace.com/forum/eng/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=4668&start=0&hilit=yambu+clave
It goes into somewhat more detail than you are asking about but all good stuff.
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby congamyk » Sun Jun 21, 2009 5:48 pm

Great find QG, thanks for posting those!
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby windhorse » Sun Jun 21, 2009 6:30 pm

That was kind of cool how they reversed the tone and slap pattern in the second video - Yambu 2
We do it that first way, but sometimes add a fourth drum where someone plays the regular Guaguanco tres dos Havana style. Makes the whole thing be really full,, but it's nice when really sparse.. Less is more.. sometimes. :D
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby Quinto Governor II » Tue Jun 23, 2009 1:26 am

Thanks for the comments guys. I have a slow processor, if you get my drift, and therefore; don't comprehend notation very well. The thread thomas newton linked to was very interesting, however; the statement about rumba clave used in yambu confuses me. Is the 7 stroke clave that's used, is what, is being referred to as rumba clave? I can't recall hearing any yambu's played with rumba clave, only son and the other example, which I refer to as the 7 stoke clave.
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby Derbeno » Tue Jun 23, 2009 2:14 am

Not sure what you mean by seven stroke. But generally Yambu is played with son clave and considered the correct way by purists. But I have also heard well known artists also play it with a Rumba clave.

Maybe Barry Guarachon has a considered opinion.
Last edited by Derbeno on Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby windhorse » Tue Jun 23, 2009 4:21 am

No Rumba clave is 5 strokes,, and the rumba clave is part of the 7 stroke yambu clave
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby guarachon63 » Tue Jun 23, 2009 10:40 pm

Offhand, based on my memories of recordings (and not local practices) I would say that the "long clave" (to coin a term - I'm referring the 7-note one called "Matanzas Yambú Clave" in the video) is indeed commonly used in Matanzas for yambú.

Some exceptions though that come to mind are "Congo Yambumba" and "El Kikirikí" on the Muñequitos' "Congo Yambumba" album, which are listed in the notes as yambús and use rumba clave, though they are only moderately slower than the guaguancós on that album.

On the other hand, I can't recall hearing the "long clave" in a yambú of any havana-based group, though it come up quite a bit in early rumba recordings (at faster tempos in both guaguancós and columbias) and you can hear it in columbias in more modern recordings (I think the ones on "Rapsodia Rumbera."

In my personal experience I once (mid-1990's) played the long clave during a workshop on yambú with a famous rumbero in Havana and he looked at me like I was crazy, saying he had never heard that played in a yambú before.

Havana groups seem to use both son clave and rumba clave in yambus. Rumba clave has been used in yambu by havana-based groups Afrekete, Carlos Embale, and Oba-Ilu.

For me it is really up to the players to decide how they want to do it, and if the song is a yambú (but it doesn't have to be) , and if the tempo is slow enough (but it doesn't have to be), then it's pretty safe to call it a yambú in my book.

The only thing I know for sure is "en el yambú no se vacuna"! :)
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby davidpenalosa » Wed Jun 24, 2009 2:45 am

The "Instrumentos de la musica folclorico-popular de cuba" identifies the seven-stroke pattern:

X . . X X . . X X . X . X . . .

as "clave Matanzas"

and the five-stroke pattern we call "son clave":

X . . X . . X . . . X . X . . .

as "clave Havana".

You can hear Carlos Embale use "clave Havana" ("son clave") on yambu and guaguanco on Festival in Havana (1955). You can hear Los Muñequitos use "clave Matanzas" for guaguanco on Guaguanco Vols. 1 and 2 (1956). These are two of the first recordings of folkloric rumba.
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby Quinto Governor II » Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:43 am

guarachon63 wrote:Offhand, based on my memories of recordings (and not local practices) I would say that the "long clave" (to coin a term - I'm referring the 7-note one called "Matanzas Yambú Clave" in the video) is indeed commonly used in Matanzas for yambú.

Some exceptions though that come to mind are "Congo Yambumba" and "El Kikirikí" on the Muñequitos' "Congo Yambumba" album, which are listed in the notes as yambús and use rumba clave, though they are only moderately slower than the guaguancós on that album.

On the other hand, I can't recall hearing the "long clave" in a yambú of any havana-based group, though it come up quite a bit in early rumba recordings (at faster tempos in both guaguancós and columbias) and you can hear it in columbias in more modern recordings (I think the ones on "Rapsodia Rumbera."

In my personal experience I once (mid-1990's) played the long clave during a workshop on yambú with a famous rumbero in Havana and he looked at me like I was crazy, saying he had never heard that played in a yambú before.

Havana groups seem to use both son clave and rumba clave in yambus. Rumba clave has been used in yambu by havana-based groups Afrekete, Carlos Embale, and Oba-Ilu.

For me it is really up to the players to decide how they want to do it, and if the song is a yambú (but it doesn't have to be) , and if the tempo is slow enough (but it doesn't have to be), then it's pretty safe to call it a yambú in my book.

The only thing I know for sure is "en el yambú no se vacuna"! :)


Thanks! guarachon63. That really cleared it up for me, and the last line sums it up. : >) You are a wealth of knowledge and I always look forward to your post. Thanks also, for posting those lyrics in the other thread
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby taikonoatama » Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:34 am

I went through all my recordings looking for all the yambú I have and found about 50 tracks. The clave and palitos are all over the map - you really hear just about every possible combination, though as Barry (guarachon63) mentions, it's really the Matanzas artists/groups that do the 7-note clave (Grupo AfroCuba, Los Munequitos, and Regino Jimenez). Here are the combos I hear in the tracks I have:

son clave with one of the most common guaguanco palitos patterns (call it pattern #1)
[x-xx-x-xx-x-xx-x]

son clave with the other most most common guaguanco palitos patterns (call it pattern #2)
[xx-xxx-xx-x-xx-x]

rumba clave with palitos playing the 7-note pattern

rumba clave with #1 palitos pattern:
[x-xx-x-xx-x-xx-x]

rumba clave with #2 palitos pattern:
[xx-xxx-xx-x-xx-x]

7-note clave with #1 palitos pattern:
[x-xx-x-xx-x-xx-x]

7-note clave with #2 palitos pattern:
[xx-xxx-xx-x-xx-x]

I whittled the yambu tracks down to 26 across a wide range of eras, groups, and locales, put them together in a zip file and threw it up on my server. I don't want to put the link up here but if you'd like it, send me a private message and I'll send you the URL for the download. About 150MB. Not sure how long I'll leave it up - so grab it while you can.

James

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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby bongosnotbombs » Sat Jun 27, 2009 3:20 am

I brought this subject up in a rumba lecture series with John Santos a little while ago.
He confirmed that all three claves are used in yambu.

My teachers have taught me 2 claves for yambu. the one from Havana, typically uses rumba clave for yambu,
and from the one from Matanzas it is "Clave Matanzas" for yambu. Then there is son clave.
Most of the people I play with here, will accept all three for yambu.
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Re: Yambu Clave

Postby Congadelica » Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:38 am

Jusy to confirm . " clave for yambu Habana y Matancero . son clave xxx xx = Habana, x xx xxxx= matacero also is possible to use rumba clave in some situationes . this what I have been told .
Just to add to the confusion ha .
Ache

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