Playing with amplification ?

[skinslapper]

I 've noticed in the years of playing that a lot of conga players use amplification at bars or small veneu's.
And i also noticed the can't play at the volume of the band .

I 've played my bongo next to many them and was loud enough without amplification !
In my opinion this is bad techniek as i've been thougt that with good techniek you don't need amplification In small venue's !
And i've had a great teacher !!!

I dont want to boast or anything , its just what i've experienced over the years !!

What do you think ?

[CongaTick]

"I 've played my bongo next to many them and was loud enough without amplification !"

what about congas? Have you played them in the same venue environment? Bongos which are higher pitched will cut through without mic-ing. But yes---unless it's an acoustic set-- with all of the electronically amped guitars, basses and bashing drummers-- you bet I use all the amping I can get : 5 mics into a mixer for a 1/4" out. But I guess you'll say it's "bad technique". And I won't argue.

[jorge]

It all depends on the kind of gig, if you are background music in a restaurant, playing with a full on salsa or timba band with horns and amplified bass, piano, drums/timbales, or something in between. Generally, if the whole band is amplified and the music is expected to be moderately loud, like at a dance, good sound reinforcement is your friend and can save you a lot of pain. Of course good technique is essential, but that is true loud or soft. Just putting up a mic and running it through the PA will often not be good enough if you don't know how to get strong, clean and distinct sounds out of your drums. The loudness of your playing at the location of the mic has to be a good bit louder than the backline / stage volume for the mic to work well. The loudest sound at the mic wins. Of course Mongo in his younger days was famous for being heard clearly over a whole band before close-mic'ed sound reinforcement became popular, but then again he wound up needing multiple hand surgeries and serious finger protection for most of the rest of his career.

But often amplification is not necessary. If you are playing with real musicians (my prejudices are showing) who know how to play to the room and understand musical dynamics, you will rarely need mics and amplification in a small venue, either on bongo or conga. If you play with idiots (there we go again) who always play as loud as possible, play to act out their ego and self esteem problems, think masculinity is measured in kilowatts, are half deaf or more, don't know anything about musical dynamics and care even less, and don't have any interest in playing to the room or to the less drunk / less deaf people in the audience, then you will no doubt need as much amplification as you can get.

[windhorse]

If you play with idiots (there we go again) who always play as loud as possible, are acting out their ego and self esteem problems, think masculinity is measured in kilowatts, are half deaf or more, don't know anything about musical dynamics and care even less, and don't have any interest in playing to the room or to the less drunk (ie, less deaf) people in the audience, then you will no doubt need as much amplification as you can get.

Well said.. These guys here at the Afro-Cuban camp are teaching us all about that, just by watching and being there. They hear everything, and can make a giant thump in your chest almost knocking you over if they want. The lead singer often brings them down REALLY low right after a gigantic crescendo when a new song gets started. They often go through several series of songs way up, then backing off, then way up again several times before stopping the music. The dynamics start with respect for everything in the room! I'm trying to teach my group of friends back home this characteristic and it's starting to have an effect. It's up to us to teach our groups and other musicians about this respect for the MUSIC.

[jorge]

Just to be clear, I was talking about playing with bands, conjuntos, and other groups that use amplified instruments. I don't remember EVER using amplification for the drums at a rumba, and I am talking about hundreds and hundreds of rumbas over a 40 year period. Staged rumba performances in theater or outside performance venues are different, but those are not what I mean by rumbas.

So in my experience, amplification for the drums is not even a consideration at rumbas. At a good rumba with less than 70 or 100 people, if the drummers are really good and listen to the singers, we don't even need mics for the singers. Of course some rumba and santo singers can seriously violate OSHA sound level limits with their unamplified voices (that is an important and much sought after part of their singing talent), but the key is the drummers listening to the singers and playing at an appropriate loudness.

[skinslapper]

"I 've played my bongo next to many them and was loud enough without amplification !"

what about congas? Have you played them in the same venue environment? Bongos which are higher pitched will cut through without mic-ing. But yes---unless it's an acoustic set-- with all of the electronically amped guitars, basses and bashing drummers-- you bet I use all the amping I can get : 5 mics into a mixer for a 1/4" out. But I guess you'll say it's "bad technique". And I won't argue.

yes also with conga's.

Well i just think that with good techniek you can be verry loud .
You don't need to play full force all the time .
And i don't say i'm right .Its just how i feel !

Most sessions i've played had ; bass drums guitar saxofoon keys and perc.

[Derbeno]

It depends on the situation rather than technique per se. Although technique plays an important part.

I play with a Classic Rock band with Bass, two guitars, Drummer, Keyboard and several voices they all get fed into a mixer where the sound guy does his stuff. No question that I get mic'ed up and fed in as well.

My first passion is with the rumberos, in that situation you try keep it down so that the singers do not have to strain.

Look at all the live Timba stuff on youtube, Pupy, Van Van, Paulito, etc, they are all mic'ed up. These congueros got more technique in their pinky finger than I can only dream of. Beware that some of the stuff from Cuban TV studio's, they are just miming and playing along.

In my humble opinion you mic up depending on the situation.