PM Percussion Wine Barrel Oak

[dende]

Yes, of course you can use a table saw when you are making straight cuts on a flat piece of wood, and you can even cut curves and radii (such as with corner moulding and baseboard) using a table saw using some advanced techniques. I've seen it done before. But we are talking about turning wine barrels into congas. The staves are already curved, arced and bevelled on both sides. I don't believe it is possible to alter them in any useful way on a table saw.

I'm just curious... If you don't mind me asking, how much do you pay for your Honduras Mahogany out there in Arizona?

i need to learn to keep an idea constant, and not to derail a post. you can use a table saw for that too if you make a jig like at 1:15 in the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwD3myUMEjA
i think thats the moperc shop. it is the discovery canada how its made voice, and it looks familiar from shots in the moperc worshop.

and it was about $160. 10.65 a board foot up to 115, and i went back for a little more when they had a sale 6.99 for the next $34
wood workers source is based here, next town over, but they also ship. http://www.woodworkerssource.com/

[Chupacabra]

That is a really good video that you provided, thanks! The woodlathe that he was using there? Awwww... that's gets me feeling all funny inside... Big $$$!

It is now clear to see how the staves can be cut on the table saw. I could not visualize that in my head until I saw it being done. I am wondering if the blanks that he starts with already have a taper, or if his table saw jig has a taper built into it that is not seen in the video. You can see at around 1:40 that the top is wider than the bottom.

If this can be done using raw materials then I can't see why it wouldn't work with pre-formed staves from a wine barrel, bearing in mind that the width of the barrel's staves will not be consistent like the shop-made ones in the video. I would divide 360 degrees by the amount of staves I want (20) and divide that total by 2 to get the saw blade angle (9 deg.). Establish the circumferences I want for at least the the top, middle and bottom of each size of drum I want to make (requinto up to super-tumba, plus bongos with the off-cuts) and divide that by the amount of staves I want to use to get the width of each stave. Then begin fabricating the jig. It would probably be best to make at least a full set of tumbadoras to make the cost of fabricating the hardware more cost-efficient.

Ohhh the gears are spinning in my head right now!

That's not a bad price for the Honduras mahogany. I paid almost CDN $13/bft for 140 bft of 6/4 x 6" plantation grown Honduras mahogany about 4 years ago and was only able to use about 80 bft.! Ah well, it didn't come out of my pocket.

[dende]

That is a really good video that you provided, thanks! The woodlathe that he was using there? Awwww... that's gets me feeling all funny inside... Big $$$!

It is now clear to see how the staves can be cut on the table saw. I could not visualize that in my head until I saw it being done. I am wondering if the blanks that he starts with already have a taper, or if his table saw jig has a taper built into it that is not seen in the video. You can see at around 1:40 that the top is wider than the bottom.

there was a needless cut in the cutting take, i think they skipped changing a jig, but i cant be sure

If this can be done using raw materials then I can't see why it wouldn't work with pre-formed staves from a wine barrel, bearing in mind that the width of the barrel's staves will not be consistent like the shop-made ones in the video. I would divide 360 degrees by the amount of staves I want (20) and divide that total by 2 to get the saw blade angle (9 deg.). Establish the circumferences I want for at least the the top, middle and bottom of each size of drum I want to make (requinto up to super-tumba, plus bongos with the off-cuts) and divide that by the amount of staves I want to use to get the width of each stave. Then begin fabricating the jig. It would probably be best to make at least a full set of tumbadoras to make the cost of fabricating the hardware more cost-efficient.

Ohhh the gears are spinning in my head right now!

That's not a bad price for the Honduras mahogany. I paid almost CDN $13/bft for 140 bft of 6/4 x 6" plantation grown Honduras mahogany about 4 years ago and was only able to use about 80 bft.! Ah well, it didn't come out of my pocket.

as long as the staves being cut are larger than the final stave size, youll be fine (why you have to shop around in person for your barrels), and your math is spot on. my lumber is 4/4, and that 140 bdft to 80 bdft problem is exactly why i dont order online, om so glad there is a warehouse down the way. if not id have to roll them bones, taking a chance on their choices being what i would want.

[blosh]

Dende, could you please post more pictures of your drum making, I am very interested.

[Psych1]

I know a wine seller that the banks are after and he has to liquidate his entire inventory - over 10,000 bottles. I just bought 10 cases of a good 2003 Bordeaux and 4 cases of an incredible 1999 Spanish Reserva - super super cheap!! Next year I am going to have one hell of a party!!!

Yesterday he came to deliver the wine and brought as a gift a 225 liter oak wine barrel with a glass top and 2 stools. The barrel is made by SEQUIN MOREAU in France and he said it is the best wine barrel in the world - costing over 600 Euro. The stools are made of "Russian Pine" zebrawood to us.

Looks like I have enough for an oak tumba and a zebrawood bongo! I'll just use it as a wine drinking table for a few years and dream of the drums I could make!! Maybe someday----------

Seqin Moreau oak wine barrel

stools of "Russian Pine"

the wines

some of the stash

[Tumbao]

I saw a pair of these at Rhythm Traders today. Nice looking, and very nice sounding, although spendy at ~$700@. I flipped one over and it has a foam brick about 3" x 3" x 12" suspended from wire in the middle of the drum (presumably to reduce ringing?). Has anyone seen anything like that on a new conga?

[Jerry Bembe]

I saw a pair of these at Rhythm Traders today. Nice looking, and very nice sounding, although spendy at ~$700@. I flipped one over and it has a foam brick about 3" x 3" x 12" suspended from wire in the middle of the drum (presumably to reduce ringing?). Has anyone seen anything like that on a new conga?

Yes, there are previous posts about controling overtones/ringing issues from the shell in this manner.

One had a short rod with a magnet on one end and foam on the other end. The magnet would stick to a metal plate inside the shell and the foam would control the overtone/ringing.

Another had a string across the interior that a cloth or anything else could be suspended from to do the same thing.

I like the string method. I have a nylon string wound around side plate bolts inside the shell and tee shirts or paper towel suspended by this string. I also use a clip on the paper towel to keep it in place. This is a cost effective simple measure to control overtones. Another nice thing is that it is easy to remove so this allows for a greater range of tonality of the conga. Sometimes you might want a overtone and this is. Still an option.

[docarroyo]

King Congas placed a piece of foam inside thier congas after a while they would dry up and fall off. You still find the residue in some models I think Echotones also used this method I can't remember for sure. I find that with the proper skin overtones are eliminated, and with time skins cure with the oils from your hands and a little help from Manteca de Corojo or Aciete de Culebra (snake Oil). I do not know if it really is snake oil but its what the bottle reads. In 40+ years I have never had to stick anything up my drums, sounds kinda funny.

[Tumbao]

Yes, there are previous posts about controling overtones/ringing issues from the shell in this manner.

I've seen those, but they were "how to fix a ringing drum". I was surprised to see it in a new drum.

[Congadelica]

I notice that some people leave the inner side of the stavles rippled or left in the roug cut. my Islas are so and dont have ay overtones. why does the inner side of the drum need to be smooth finished? its not on view and I consider this to be a factor to over tone isue which people complain about.

M

[Anonimo]

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[Marcus]

I have had a lot of experience with solid shell drums and ringing, really discourages me. Every drum needs some kind of dampening to prevent the production of overtones. Either it is going to be the wood or the skin or a mechanical device easy as foam tape or wire strings and rods with attached t-shirts and foam.

Maybe the outside rings on a thin shelled conga help to dampen the overtones, could be a wood that tends to absorb a certain harmonic due to it being softer, age of wood, Grain pattern, inside finishing, yada, yada, yada. There are so many thoughts on the head, water buffalo, rawhide to mule. Tuning hardware and tuning certainly a factor.

I just want a conga that does not ring or sound flat. I bought some solid shell congas with rope tuning and they rang so bad I was heart broken. Never buy a drum again without playing it--lesson learned, amature mistake.

One common item I have notice is inside finishing, oiled or varithaned. Seems like the bare unfinished rough wood tends to dampen some ringing. Then again the best is to have the design that does not produce overtones rather than devices to absorb.


marcus

[Anonimo]

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[Marcus]

Leedy,

Yeah my introduction to drumming was with rope tuned solid wood shells. I am not sure that any tuning would remove the ringing I found in many shells. I even tried a mule skin. My best job at reskinning a shell but as I suspected the mule was just too tough for the ropes to tune up. It was a great experience working with the mule learned much through the struggle. Did not have a local mentor on this issue so I had to learn by trial. Guinne cow was used originally and the shell was hardwood from Mali.

Right now I have a soft wood bugarabu that was finished on the inside, guinne cow for the head. I believe that the inside finishing added to the ringing and I used a muffler to seriously decrease the ring. Considering the shell and muffler and skin--that is the best it can offer.

Moving to traditional congas and Cuban technique--very soon. Good thing Mr. Conga is local. Good to hear that Tumbao played the PM Percussion drums and liked them. First one on this forum who has played them and talked about it.

I will also be traveling to Rhythm Traders soon and spend some time playing both the PM and new GB mariano. Hey Tumbao--how did the new GB mariano compare with rest of the floor selection?

peace and rhythm, marcus

[Anonimo]

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