Overtones again...! - help ad advice sought for giovanni conga

[Mike]

Hello everybody!

I´ve recently purchased a (new) Giovanni Galaxy ash wood Quinto as a solo drum at ebay.

Make no mistake: It´s a fantastic solo drum, playability, construction and hardware is really fantastic. And I´m not saying this because I spent quite some money on the drum (360,-€)

The mind-boggling question is only how to eliminate the nasty OVERTONES? :O Tuning doesn´t help much. And I don´t like the idea of putting sticky tape on the backside of the skin. To me a drumskin must be valid for itself without extra treatment (except oiling).

Is it really again a matter of skins that I´m surrounded with rining, ringing, ringing? :angry: What would you advise?
Should I change skin ? (BTW Is mounting new skins more difficult or easier with extended collar comfort curve?)

Any help is deeply appreciated!



Edited By Mike on 1177473529

[bongosnotbombs]

Make sure the head is evenly tuned all the way around...
Ringing is sometimes the result of uneven tension arond the
head.
One guy told me to wax the rim of the conga, where the skin
touches the conga, the idea is to help the skin move across the
wood easier and settle more evenly.

Other than that beat the hell out of it for a while to break it in, sometimes
heads improve with use and age.

[Mike]

Thanks for the quick reply!

Maybe it´s like you say that a new skin needs to "break in" - I wonder how long this takes...??? I guess I need some patience.
As I already said, if possible, I want to avoid to buy a new skin to replace the LP Handpicked (which looks quite OK).

Well, I have already waxed the bearing edge (with bee´s wax), so that can´t be the reason, but I think I will loosen all bolts, take the whole drumhead off and remount it to eliminate the possibility of uneven tension. Good idea!

But only after I´m back from work. Hundreds of highschool kids are yearning for their music lessons :;): :laugh:

Thanks for the input anyway, I really appreciate your replies, also in previous posts.

Greets
Mike



Edited By Mike on 1177481654

[zwar]

ho mike

can you give a date about the thickness of the skin, any differences there from one side to the other?

lp normaly put thin to medium skins on the quinto, question of being lucky...
if you want to stay at lp skins, you should order unmounted conga or even tumba skins, the tumba handpicked skins unmounted are normaly about 3mm.
if you treet the skin with glycerine, and palmoil, it should stop ringinga bit. maybe you can ask the former owner, what he did, lubracating the skin...

zwar

[Mike]

hideho zwar! Thanks 4 replying!

Here´s what I´ve just done before I started my compputer:
After having remounted the skin, I rubbed in some (rape) oil on the skin. Today´s heat will be of advantage to dry more quickly.

Then I´ll have a second try tuning it up and hitting it hard as bongosnotbombs suggested. :;):

As to the thickness: It is 2mm throughout, I guess that´s okay? I´m actually quite satisfied with the head, I´ve seen much thinner heads on LP Classic quintos, for example.
zwar, don´t too thick heads (3mm on a quinto) hurt your hands? Quinto is tuned high always.... The Giovanni can take the pull, but whaddabout yo hands? As I´m not Mr Hard Hands but just an ambitious hobby drummer , I guess I have to focus on technique first... :laugh:

What I get from posts prior to this is that the tone of a conga will become more mellow time after time.
Now I´m going to let the time factor work...

[deadhead]

As expressed in another recent post, your ringing may be comming from the Comfort Curve rim. Try not cranking it up so high. Just because its a quinto doesn't mean it has to be cranked as high as it goes, and since you're playing it as a single, I would tune it low like a conga. This will help your ringing problem.

From my experience mounting heads (which is very little), the comfort 2 is the hardest to tuck. I had a really hard time cutting off the excess skin. My comfort curve 1 was much easier, and I imagine that traditional rims are even easier than that.

[bongoron]

The tape works...I'm unsure why you expect the skin to stand on its own merit if it rings. Still, have you stood back at audience distance while a conguero plays to see if these overtones interfere with the tone you want? I have done the tape on my quinto, tuned it lower (didn't care for the pitch change personally)...and I truly prefer the tape. Actually, the ringing didn't make it to the audience..I just wanted it gone. Nobody has ever asked me about the tiny square of dark showing where the tape is underneath the head. Certainly nobody has ever disliked the tone enough to say "what's wrong with your quinto?" :laugh: This was also true without the tape...my friends are very kind. I think if you try the tape (plain old duct tape)...you may be able to overcome the apprehension of using it.

God bless!

-Ron



Edited By bongoron on 1177511947

[Mike]

Still, have you stood back at audience distance while a conguero plays to see if these overtones interfere with the tone you want? (...) Actually, the ringing didn't make it to the audience..

It´s funny, that is precisely what I tried out also, i.e. asking listeners what the drum sound is like. And indeed, it´s amazing that the overtones don´t cut through, but yo slaps do :laugh:
To be serious, what you get as an "entity", I mean the ensemble sound is what counts, you have a point there :;):

In the past I also experimented recording my congas to see what sound is actually projected. (mic->PC)

Having just cranked up my quinto, I notice that the higher you get (towards upper ´c´) the less overtones you hear without losing that wonderful crispy sound or the open tones. So I´m quite relieved

I think if you try the tape (plain old duct tape)...you may be able to overcome the apprehension of using it.

Yes I tried the tape with an old conga with too thin head - and it works perfectly well there. BTW I used an old REMO Pad for Bass Drums, which is just as sticky as required!
I just don´t think I´ll need it on my beloved Giovanni quinto any longer
It´s a matter of taste, of course.

Thanks for the interesting discussion so far!



Edited By Mike on 1177514391

[caballoballo]

Mike,save youself some headaches,sleepless nights and any other body malfuction related to the overtone. Get a new mediun thickness skin, Mule, Cow or Steer will do the job,also the new tucket version of the fiberskyn will do. That treated head hand picket or not is the failure, water bison heads are always kaput.

[bongosnotbombs]

It's a good point about the overtones making it to the audience, etc.
But you are the one thats going to hear the drum the most, during practice and play so it's got to sound good to the player!
A mule skin would probably solve all your problems, but its going to cost you $$$.
But its true, self mounted heads almost always sound better than factory installed ones, especially the premounted ones.
However you should be able to get the skin you have now wounding better with all the advice given. and it helps you to get aquainted with a new drum.
Eventually though you will probably want a mule skin that you mount yourself, in all likelihood the sound will dramatically improve.......................G!

[Mike]

Yeah, OF COURSE I would like to have a mule skin - for my quinto, of course !!!

But you are perfectly right about the $-factor ,
especially in Germany. I wouldn´t even know where to get one.
The only thing seems to have a decent JCR-Mulo by Isaac shipped to good (?) old (?) Germany, but
a I cannot choose it myself then
and
b it´s darn expensive

So perhaps I should starting hunting mules :laugh:

I absolutely back you up, nothing can beat self-mounted skins ...



Edited By Mike on 1177517831

[bongosnotbombs]

There's a thread in another part of the forum talking about this same thing, it's in the techniques section

http://www.congaplace.com/cgi-bin....13;st=0



Edited By bongosnotbombs on 1177525535

[Mike]

Oh, BTW, here comes another skin question:

Is(self-mounted) cowhide really preferable to the factory-mounted Lp buffalos?
-> I´ve just seen cowhide at German ebay:

[url=http://cgi.ebay.de/Trommelfell-D50-Kuh-fuer-Conga-oder-aehnliche-Trommel_W0QQitemZ270112423636QQihZ017QQcateg
oryZ23309QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem]http://cgi.ebay.de/Trommel....iewItem[/url]

Any opinions?


Plus I´d like to where u can get mule skins in Europe...!?!

Attachment: http://mycongaplace.com/forum/eng/uploa ... bc34_1.JPG

[deadhead]

Cow is going to sound much better than water buffalo. The only place I've ever seen mule skins is JCR through Isaac. I can't read that ebay link because its in German? but 30 euros seems like a good deal if it is quality skin.

[Mike]

Thanks, deadhead!

Yes, the web link was in German, sorry :;):
I just thought cow might do with my giovanni quinto. The price for the skins is OK, but I´d like to see them first... The next skin dealer is in Cologne..

I´ve just taken a look at JCR´s mule skins at ebay.com - they look promising indeed. It´s another level, of course both in quality and price....
The thing is you shouldn´t scrimp and save on skins - but of course my kids want something to eat next month, too :laugh: :laugh:
To be dead serious: I´m really tempted to try out a mule skin - at least once in my life