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What do you think of bell players that do not do the:

* . * .. * .. * ..

they play:

* .. * .. * .. * ..


See min. 2:34

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjXW5P7g34c

Sounds good to me!

Sometimes playing like that tends to up the tempo but the clave is there anyway. Is no problem playing that way.

I would not get too worked up about it.
I went back and listened to some Sierra Maestra and Septeto Habanero in my iTunes...sometimes the bell is marking the clave other times it's not.

Another example:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bD4dxcZJmwc

In my opinion and in relation to clave this first pattern ( * . * .. * .. * ..) differetiates
the 2 side of the clave from the 3 side. Is my understanding that the quarter on the second
beat have to fall on the 2 side of the clave, always.

This second pattern (* .. * .. * .. * ..) does not diifferentiate one side of the clave from the other.
since the notes on the second beat of either side of the clave are the same (1/8 notes).

Just one quarter note changes the whole feeling of the hand bell pattern.

min. 1:44 , handbell clave signal and chorus

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHXpuR-gTfw

shor wrote:What do you think of bell players that do not do the:

* . * .. * .. * ..

they play:

* .. * .. * .. * ..


See min. 2:34

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjXW5P7g34c

-> * .. * .. * .. * .. <- Was an older (well established) way many bongoceros played the bell in Cuba for 'SONES'.

Listen to the pattern Ricardo Vidal Ferro Vicente plays on the bell in this video, I referrer to it is as an "Older" (Cuban) Son bell pattern.
Youtube video: Dig it-->
http://youtu.be/yjXW5P7g34c

Additionally... the bongocero in this video with Joseíto Fernández plays the same (older) pattern.
http://fidelseyeglasses.blogspot.com/2010/06/joseito-fernandez.html

I often play this pattern myself... especially if I want to mess with the "rhythmic sensibility" of "Salsa" musicians who can't feel it and think it's "wrong". jejeje!

shor wrote:min. 1:44 , handbell clave signal and chorus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHXpuR-gTfw

Not sure what you are saying, but the bongo bell comes in right on clave at 1:44 and plays the standard salsa campana part in clave through the song. The conga player crosses clave at 3:18 (in a song to Justi Barreto no less), but the bongo player is on the money.

It is not always easy to understand in various internet forums/interest groups in text what someone is trying to mean/get an idea or point across.
From what I understood from the original poster of this thread is his questioning the 'ride' pattern the bongocero is playing in the video he posted of the Mexican group playing a Son.

The player in the Mexican group plays an older style/pattern of cowbell/campana, with two beats on the back end consecutively throughout his ride.
Phonetically sounding like: Toe ti-ki-Toe ti-ki-Toe ti-ki Toe.
As opposed to what is commonly now played in Salsa: Toe ti-ki-Toe ti-ki-Toe ti---Toe.

jorge wrote:bongo bell comes in right on clave at 1:44 and plays the standard salsa campana part in clave

Yes, he is signalizing "clave de son"; Juan Rodriguez of Wayne Gorbea band.

FidelsEyeglasses wrote:
-> * .. * .. * .. * .. <- Was an older (well established) way many bongoceros played the bell in Cuba for 'SONES'.


I often play this pattern myself... especially if I want to mess with the "rhythmic sensibility" of "Salsa" musicians who can't feel it and think it's "wrong". jejeje!

Thanks for the data of first hand...

Cortijo Jr, fine bell touch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=6VIhp8gBIVA

I do not care too much about the bell
I am paying attention to the Master
playing one conga in different styles
with "mucho afinque y saoco". Excellent
video Shor, brought back lots of good
memories, thank you for sharing.

Ah, he is the nephew , not the son.