Argh! Microphone Questions!

[akdom]

No, no distortion at all. They are made for that purpose.

The price is around 100 euros but you will keep them for life.

It is the best investment we made with the band in years....


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[Gallichio]

To say a Shure SM57 is not for percussion is like saying a conga is not a drum. SM57s have been used for years live and in studios all over the world for drums and percussion. They sound awesome on congas.

[akdom]

Yes, you are right, but technology and time gave the oportunity to develop new products.

I used to have 57s before. And then, since I am playing in a 10 piece band, the congas needed "real" amplification. I then got my new mics......

It's like comparing a 1950 fiat 500 with the latest porsche cayenne... both are cars..... both can make you travel from point A to point B, but the comfort is not exactly the same.

I am just talking about my experience. And just look around and you'll see that almost no pro band uses SM57s anymore to amplify drums. The 57s have too wide of a spectra compare to new generation of mics that just focus on a 5 to 10 square centimeters patch on your skins.


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[Gallichio]

Well again I believe tons of bands and studios still use the Shure SM57. Don't you think the Shure company has made any improvements in the last 40 years or so? If you like the mics you have thats great. If they help you with the sound you are trying to create then they are right for you. Enjoy and have fun.

[jorge]

Akdom, I think the Fiat / Porsche comparison is inaccurate. There is not that big a difference in sound. In spite of the longer history of the SM57, to my ear, the SM57 sounds better on congas than the Sennheiser e604 or the e904, although the Sennheisers are lighter, smaller, more convenient, and cheaper. I think the slaps, both closed, open, sound more natural through the SM57 than either the e604 or e904. I have used all 3. Mic placement is very important and SM57s on mic stands give you much more flexibility if you know what you are doing and experiment a bit. On a quinto or smaller conga, the Sennheisers can get in your way while you are playing and some conga players won't use them. All 3 have a similar cardioid pattern of pickup at 1 kHz. Tonio and Akdom, neither of the Sennheisers or the MD421-II is actually supercardioid or hypercardioid as you are suggesting, all are cardioid. Although the e604 and e904 have a little more lobing and stray pickup at 180 degrees off axis at 125 Hz as well as 2kHz and some higher frequencies, given the direction the mics will be aimed, the close micing, and the relatively high sound level of the congas onstage, this is not a big deal and feedback is not generally a significant problem with conga mics. Frequency response and polar patterns can be seen at the Microphone-Data.com website (you have to register and login).

http://www.microphone-data.com/microphone.asp?mic=424

For live use onstage with multiple different percussion instruments like conga, bongo, timbales, and drumset, the SM57 gives much more flexibility. The Oktava MK012 sounds a bit brittle on congas to my ear but can sound really good with a little EQ. It is more of a recording mic and allows you to switch capsules from cardioid to omnidirectional. I have not tried the Sennheisers on bongo. For congas, being attached to the rim can cause the Sennheisers to pick up some of the unwanted sounds, transmitted through the mic mount, of your hands hitting the edge of the drum. Whether this is loud enough to be heard depends on your playing technique and other factors, try recording the sound off the mixer and listen to see. You get some of this effect with the LP Claw, but it is not as loud as with the Sennheisers. On the other hand, mic stands standing on the floor can pick up stray sounds of walking or foot tapping if you don't use a low cut (high pass) filter at 80 or 100 Hz. For your uses on many different percussion instruments, I think the SM57s will give you more flexibility and better sound if you are willing to buy, lug around, set up and takedown all the mic stands. If you want convenience generally limited to congas and toms, try either the Sennheiser e604 or e904. I have not found much difference in sound between those 2 Sennheisers and the e604 is lighter, cheaper, and less "bouncy" on its plastic clip than the e904. The MD421-II is really expensive for live use, and breaks more easily than the other mics, so for those reasons it is more of a recording mic than a live onstage mic.

[Victorius]

ok maybe comparing sm57 and E604 isn't exactly as big difference as Fiat and the newest Porshe I think sm57 is very good for many aplications so that's why is well known and used by many musicians. Probably E604 is a little better cause designed for drums... ok what about OTHER mics from my list? Any experience? Am looking for very good mics in medium prizes (200 - 300 Euro per mic) and do something more with them than only "be heard on stage". Am going to use them also for recording so...?

[akdom]

Jorge

I knew the fiat Porsche would make people react.

I am deeply convinced that the SM57 are less suitable for congas. Once again, it is only my experience. They are absolutely not in my way when I play. The only problem I could think of is if playing with more than 3 drums, but the problem would be the same with or without stands.

I was not fully aware of the technical specs between the two models, but anyway, once again, this is my opinion according to my experience.

I can only ad that the E604, to me has a much much much better sound quality for live concerts AND recordings. The sound is sharper, clearer and easier to control.

But again, sm57 are more famous indeed... I can only suggest to try both, and/or to have others posting their comments too.


Thanks anyway for this post since micing is quite important for a full satisfaction.

PS: I had a rehearsal yesterday in a new place and I only had 57s to mic my drums.... I couldn't hear anything and the others even less....


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[jorge]

Because it is a clip-on, the e604 is automatically placed in a good location for that mic. I think if you play around with mic placement of the SM57, recording each different placement through the mixer, you will hear that the SM57s sound really good when placed in the right spot. For placement, check out where Sandy Perez has his SM57s in the photos just posted on this site:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=4329

If you don't like the sound there, move them around a little. Once you have the SM57s placed in good spots, I think you will find that the differences in sound between the e604s and the SM57s are not as big as you are suggesting. Saying that SM57s are not suitable for congas, or that professional groups don't use them for congas anymore is just plain wrong.

[korman]

Akdom, are you using one E604 for each drum?
Do you think one mic of this type could be placed to pick up two drums somehow?

[akdom]

Akdom, are you using one E604 for each drum?
Do you think one mic of this type could be placed to pick up two drums somehow?

I am affraid to give you wrond avices lol...

The e604 is too "direct" to me. I tried to mic up 3 congas with 2 mics attached on stands and I really didn't like it at all. I am used to have one sound per drum with the mic quite clos to the skin in order to get the full sound out of them.

But with a small formation, you might be able to get some soud out of your drums with even 1 mic.

(and just for info, I do not know any conguero around me using sm57)

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[Whopbamboom]

Probably should mention that on the SM57, only brand new mics from an authorized Shure distributor should be purchased. This is one mic that has been counterfeited (with poor internals) in China. Supposedly lots floating around out there. I don't think this applies to the Beta 57 though.