Help pidoca find his groove

[pidoca]

G'day all. I hope this finds you well.

I am in need of some help.

GROOVE!!!!

what is it?
How do you define it?
how do I get it?
How do I practice it?
how much is it?
who has it?

I have been listening to cassandra wilson lately, 'rhythm of the sun' some very tastefull percussion on there. the patterns are not very hard to play. but wow are they tasteful and grooving.

I am not the best player around, but can hold my own in some circles; but I seem to lack that elusive GROOVE factor. I am an analitical type of guy and if I can understand it then I can do it. I think that is why I am having some many problems; groove is not mathematical. or is it?

can you guys give me some advice.

PIDOCA'S WEBSITE

[bongoron]

My groove changes with the band I play in. In my outreach band, it changes with nearly every number. In the church band, it's a Jesus groove and very basic. In the outreach band, it's a Jesus groove that rocks or softly sways, depending on the gig and the song. I think groove is dependent on the moment...my practice groove is based on the material I have to play along with.
I think you should begin looking in Sydney...just kidding. Look inside and really get loose in the music...works for me.


God bless!

-Ron



Edited By bongoron on 1147316605

[ABAKUA]

Hey Richard

Hope you and your family are doing great.. How are things with the pregnancy? My love to you and the family...

Now, I see you've come to the point in your percussion journey/learning where you are searching to identify your sound/unique signature in your playing.

How do you find your groove, well... As a mentor I advise you to listen to all that you can, watch all those you can, both live and recorded...All genres...

Practise, both on your own enclosed with no disturbance, and along to music also. Do this for long periods of time, repetition is the key...

What or who do you identify with in your playing? Ask yourself this.

Id encourage you to play rumba with other drummers, next time you know you will be in Sydney let me know, I can invite you to some of the rumbas I attend, even if you dont feel up to joining in, at least be part of the atmosphere, soak it in, it all helps!

The answers you are looking for come to you over time. Inside you there is a rumbero wanting to come out, I think its time you started coming over again for further development and discovery of the drum.


Which reminds me... I still have that CD case of yours here... :;):

[CongaTick]

The harder you look for it the more elusive it will become. The groove IS already in you. (Any writer that tries to find a style will find one, but it will be a superimposed, contrived interpretation, not one that flows naturally from the heart.) Relax. Enjoy. Continue practcing. EN-JOY. Your groove will be something OTHER people will identify in your playing, and you will not even be aware of what they are referring to.

[windhorse]

Just a few nights ago during a lesson with a friend/mentor/teacher of Latin percussion, he said, and I'm paraphrasing, "I can feel where you want to go with your leads, but your timing is slightly off so it doesn't groove."
This hurts a bit since I've worked a bunch on the quinto leads lately. I've been told by some other friends that I'm not hitting in exactly the right spots.
So, back to the drawing board. He said he would help me with some timing exercises. In a way I felt like a little turd, but in another way, it's nice to be humbled again and start on a different climb to higher levels of understanding.

[pidoca]

HI guys thank you very much for your comments.

Practice, practice, practice is what I am hearing

listen, listen, listen then practice some more.

abakua the family is going great. Sorry that I have not been down lately. been really busy lately. have started my own massage business and it is really busy. Don't get full days off any more. As well as working full time and fitting in the odd gig. very busy.

the pregnancy is going great. Her belly is bigger than mine. no mean feat. Hooray.

Windhorse I too have been humbled and put in my place a few times. honesty is so good for the soul.

Thanks for the reminder Ron.

Contick I really like your analagy (spl?) so true. I guess I have been thinking about it too much. reminds me of a book by Paulo Coelho 'the pilgrims progress' I think that is what it is called.

any suggestion on good recording of groove conga/percussion playing?

[OLSONGO]

The groove is in the song and the cats you play with, you know it
you feel it. When every one knows his place, and an agreement in how the song should swing. Otherwise is like falling down stairs and I have been there, and thats how you learn to differentiate.
To groove or not to groove
That is the question
Lets say when yo play a nice Rumba and all is in Clave.

[bongoron]

I remembered a thing that happened not too long ago. I learned from a visual check of my silent metronome that i have a tendency to rush when I play alone. this makes it harder for me to synchronize with a band when we get together (brutal self critique, humbling, but necessary). I started turning on the beeper for a larger percentage of the practice time at home. When I added more drums, the added activity eliminated my rushing at the higher tempos (probably should have seen that one coming), but aggrevated it at the slower ones...go figure. Once I get in my own band, though, all is well (not true in the church band where tempo problems plague many members). I think maybe I'm too rigid in practice sometimes and I miss the point. This week I missed two practices with the band, and the drummer sent me a message. He told the lead singer/guitar it really sounded empty when I'm gone, and that he can't believe how much difference those little fills make (I also play tumbao variations and pop rhythms throughout every song, obviuosly). That's what I needed right about now...pretty discouraging when the work schedule gets in the way of the band. Abakua's point about playing with others may be the biggest one for me, since the closest teacher I'm aware of is 2 hours away. Just relying on digital time keepers won't develop the groove, IMHO and experience. You need real people who are also looking for theirs. Good luck finding your groove! I'll bet it's right around the corner.

God bless!

-Ron

[Smejmoon]

For me groove is about managing expectations. Setting something and then carefully adding some surprises. Surprising and then going back to something what is wanted.

And the first test I passed, when I could make random people dance by my rhythm.

Now there are much more to do..

Believing what you do and doing it with emotions also helps. It might not move everyone, but at least you know it's possible. There are times when I just lack skills to play what's inside. I think that can be developed.



Edited By Smejmoon on 1147374249

[OLSONGO]

When you play by yoursel you control your own groove, but music being a social thing ( tell that to those who use drum machines) when playing with the band, the groove becomes a group thing. When you play, you play a song; has a certain feel and everyone in the band must follow accordingly, and feel it, FEEL IT- can't demand that enough; otherwise it sounds like s--t. And in most cases if there is a vocalist, he must be able to sing and he usually sets the tempo, so that he can sing in a relaxed way. If you ruch or lag, you are in your own world and not paying attention.

[mangorockfish]

To me, the groove is when you're playing something you really like and are comfortable playing and all of a sudden it hits you that this REALLY sounds good and it puts you in a uphoric state of mind by just listening to it. This can be alone or in a group playing situation. Just my $.02 worth.
Mango'

[JohnnyConga]

Groove IS ALL OF THE ABOVE!....listen to Mongo Santamaria ...listen to the latin/Jazz side of Ray Baretto....listen to Patato....Giovanni...Chembo....and so many more "Groove" players , plus the ones in other musical categories....Earl DeRuen(Donny Hathaway)....Master Henry Gibson(Curtis Mayfield)....Derf Reklaw Raheem(Lonnie Liston Smith).....i could go on ....MAY THE GROOVE BE WITH YOU!...."JC" Johnny Conga.....

[pidoca]

Thanks once again;

groove is so subjective, i have been in similar situations to all of the posts.

for me the way mangorock describes it really hit home. Thanks mate.

I guess I had forgoten it.

thanks all you guys are the best.

bless ya